Unions to vote on Kings' fate

2012-07-16 22:23

Cape Town - The presidents of South Africa's 14 provincial unions will vote later this year to determine if the Southern Kings should play Super Rugby in 2013.

Die Burger
was reliably informed that the South African Rugby Union's (SARU) CEO Jurie Roux scheduled a meeting for August 16 when the unions will decide on the Kings' fate.

The presidents will apparently be given the following options to choose from:

- The Kings gain Super Rugby promotion at the expense of the Lions;

- The Kings gain promotion, work together with the Lions, with the Lions' top players then playing their Super Rugby in Port Elizabeth in 2013;

- The Lions and Cheetahs merge to again become a franchise (they played together as the Cats from 1998-2005);

- Rugby bosses decide they've made a mistake and the Kings won't be allowed to play Super Rugby next year.

This comes after renewed uncertainty with the Weekend Argus reporting on Sunday that the Kings accepted a multi-million rand offer from SARU to postpone their inclusion in the Super Rugby competition. The report stated that the Kings agreed to delay their Super Rugby entry until 2016 in exchange for R40m and Currie Cup Premier Division status from next year.

But the Kings were quick to deny this report and posted the following on their twitter page on Sunday: "The story going around we've taken money to stay out of Super Rugby in 2013 is NOT TRUE ! We will be playing Super Rugby in 2013."

Earlier this year, the 14 provincial unions voted for the Kings to be included in Super Rugby in 2013 - with a promise also made by SARU to the sports ministry. But at that stage SARU was hoping to convince the Southern Hemisphere’s governing body, SANZAR, to extend the Super Rugby competition to 16 teams, which would allow South Africa to field six sides.

However, SANZAR made it clear that the competition will stay with 15 teams for at least the next few years which resulted in the current issue involving the Kings.


  • tom.tardis - 2012-07-16 22:35


      tokolos.bloutokkie - 2012-07-16 22:51

      Ek sal jou mos half doodbliksem jou klein k*k

      tokolos.bloutokkie - 2012-07-16 22:51

      tom jou d**s

      Rich - 2012-07-17 01:10

      No prizes for guessing which person commenting on this site is both the most immature and the biggest berk.

      nick.armstrong.1800 - 2012-07-17 12:08

      No Tom - are you on bad pills mate?? My opinion – which is kinda what I suggested a while back – is option 2: The Lions and Kings play together. Simple – and stuff – just stuff – any idea of forcing the 4th team on the SA log (ie Cheetahs) having to amalgamate with the Lions!! WhyTF should a SECOND team (incl. their sponsors) currently playing Super Rugby (and deserving to be there on rugby merit) be hamstrung by being forced to amalgamate with another team - simply in order to accommodate those useless morons – the Kings – and his Royal T#rdiness - Cheeky Watson?? AND - thus implying the Kings deserve a stand-alone team in Super Rugby – before the Cheetahs do!!??? A stand-alone team in Super Rugby when the useless "begging bowl" of SA rugby can't even beat Boland in Currie Cup 2nd division rugby??? Hahahahahahahahaha! Are they mad - or is it typical pathetic African political appeasement at work…??? The Cheetahs should NOT even be in this equation!! It’s got NOTHING to do with them – they did not come last on the log – it’s an issue between the Lions (who came last) and the Kings – that’s it!! Simple: Kings and Lions to play together – the players can fly between PE and Jozi – JUST as easily as between Bloemfontein and Jozi – no difference – except approx 30 mins flying time...

      nick.armstrong.1800 - 2012-07-17 13:07

      Oh - and by the way - the only reason I'm suggesting the Lions and Kings play together - is that a promise was made to the Kings - which has to be honoured, I guess... The ideal would be for the Kings to wait until 2016 (play Currie Cup until then) - however - if they HAVE to be accommodated in 2013 as per the promise made - then my suggestion as per above (Lions and Kings play together) - is the best option (in my opinion)... Whatever is decided - no matter what - it has nothing to do with the Cheetahs. They are out of any equation involving possible "amalgamations"... This is between the the team that came last (Lions) and the KIngs - that's it. Don't punish a 2nd team currently playing Super Rugby in order to placate a mis-placed promise... !

      tom.tardis - 2012-07-17 14:12

      first as in first to post on the thread.

  • grant.butler.104 - 2012-07-16 22:40

    What an absolute mess.....SARU....this is a new low in Corporate Governance....

      alansmartSnr - 2012-07-16 22:59

      The kings couldn't even make in the Curry Cup league - they would just be a nuisence in the super league. But good luck to them if they make it. It would realy surprise me.

      JaredVN - 2012-07-17 06:52

      The original reasons for including the Kings were supposedly to promote a) EP talent, and b) transformation in the Eastern Cape. Although the Lions or whoever loses out may feel hard done by, the 2 issues above were at least fair reasons for including the Kings. However, the loathsome Puke and Cheeky clearly do NOT want to promote EP talent and don't give a stuff about transformation, because now they already want to import players from elsewhere. So clearly what the Kings are really about, is an ego trip for the loathsome Watson cANCer cadres, and especially a money-making racket for them.

  • - 2012-07-16 22:47

    the only reason they want this is to get people into that white elephant stadium, but they forget that people wont come watch a team get there a$$ handed to them week in and week out!! i say make the cheetahs, lions and kings 1 team, maybe just maybe, they will finish second last instead of dead last, maybe!!

      Dakey - 2012-07-16 23:08

      We haven't had any problems filling our stadium Pat, nor have we had any problem remembering the words to our national anthem. Yes the Kings will get their rear ends handed to them, but would it be any different from the lions? Have you seen how few people actually go watch Lions games? On home grown talent alone, the Kings would have both Dewalt as well as Jaques Potgieter, Keagan Daniel and Kankowski... I'd bet they'd still manage to pull more spectators than the Lions have.

      koos.vandermerwe.338 - 2012-07-17 02:32

      Weet nie of jou 'home grown' talent regtig saam met puke en pa gesien wil word nie. Party mense het darem nog standaarde.

      Jaco van Niekerk - 2012-07-17 06:07

      Dakey, let me see if I understand this correctly. If you want to play rugby in SA, you have to play in the province you were born in? In a democracy? In the year 2012? That said, SARU made their own bed on this one, a real nice mess.

      paddy.carolan.35 - 2012-07-17 07:32

      Dakeras and others seem to think that the likes of Potgieter, Daniel, Kankowski, etc will rush back to the EP like a new Groot Trek. Watson promised that he would using new EP talent. He clearly lied, and on that basis alone the decision to allow them into Super 15 should be withdrawn. Yesterday on local radio in PE he threatened to go to his political mates. What happened to the good old days when real administrators banned countries for participating in sport when there was government meddling?

      Dakey - 2012-07-17 10:20

      @Koos: Ja Koos, was nie 'n probleem vir die Stormers nie, ne? Ek is nou wel nie 'n 'fan' van die Watson's nie, maar glo my, hulle doen tans wonders vir rugby hier. @Jaco: You don't seem to understand democracy. It actually has nothing to do with being able to play for a particular team. In the USA, you can't simply pick and choose which team you want to play for, you get drafted. Undemocratic, no just economics. Those guys UNDERSTAND that given free market factors with no restrictions it will severely curb competition. The same economic restrictions that prevent monopolies and price fixing are in play here. You only need to look at the English Premier League to see what MONEY can do. Chelsea and Man City two great examples. If you want a competitive and HEALTHY rugby union in South Africa, you will need to protect smaller clubs, either financially or at least protect their provincial talent. We're not just talking money here, we're talking about a players ability to represent their country because of the team they're playing in. Was it not Mallet who said that if you wanted to be selected for the Springboks, you had to play in team A,B or C? We only need to look at someone like Vermaak who moved to the Bulls as #2 scrummie in SA, only to sit on the bench... Does this help SA rugby? Let's be a little bit more intelligent about how provincial rugby can grow.

  • Dakey - 2012-07-16 23:04

    SO, The WEEKEND ARGUS WAS WRONG? Are they now going to issue a front page apology? No, of course not and you News24? Can you actually generate some valid news articles? Here's the bleeping problem. Does anyone appreciate that the Kings would need to ACQUIRE players for next season? How long does SARU wish to give the Kings to achieve this? 2 months? So the Kings with no budget must now compete against the freaking Lions (backed by millions) and hope the other unions will support them? Could anyone possibly run the country's rugby any worse?

      Dakey - 2012-07-16 23:12

      PS, interesting how you can't find under related articles (on the right), this one: Wonderful journalism.

      JaredVN - 2012-07-17 06:47

      Yes, they need to acquire players. So the bulls..t stories about the so-called development of EP players were lies and fabrications. They will end up like the Sharks, who are Free State A, and will no doubt plunder Lions, Free State and other provinces' players to feed the sickening greed of Cheeky and Puke, those repulsive ANC cadres.

      Marcus - 2012-07-17 09:00

      @JaredVN, I could not agree with you more. And if they do get great talent in, how are they going to fight for them, the Free State suffers to keep them home, and they do have the money. They do win games and titles.

  • Staalburger - 2012-07-16 23:16

    What do these guys get paid who made this mess? Some big bucks I think. I would have been able to create the same mess on a much lower salary. I'll submit my CV asap.

  • ChrisinOz294 - 2012-07-16 23:40

    NO! vote NO!

  • Jbyej Junaid Itaintaday - 2012-07-17 00:01

    well said Dakey! we might loose 90% of the games but our stadium will b 100% Full!

      karsten.kaminski - 2012-07-17 00:35

      Give it a game or two, remember the Lions earlier this season. Eighty odd points spring to mind, I'd like to see the attendance after a few c##k slaps neh :)

  • karsten.kaminski - 2012-07-17 00:27

    A promotion / relegation option is the biggest absentee from the voting options. Let the Kings earn their place in Super Rugby and we will all respect them. Oh wait sorry... IT'S MY RIGHT!

      koos.vandermerwe.338 - 2012-07-17 02:34

      They know they will not be able to compete on equal terms(sounds so familiar). All they can do is DEMAND.

      luke.sportify - 2012-07-17 09:10

      @ Kartsen, one side been given millions over the past few years to build a squad, the other who has only started putting a team together with no millions...great idea....NOT

  • julie.j.vanrensburg - 2012-07-17 00:33

    Here's hoping the so-called 'Kings' get a resounding NO! NO!! NO!!! I'm not a Lion's supporter, but I feel they should not be booted out just to boost the Watsons' overinflated egos. The Lions have had a bad run, I'll admit, but they also had to contend with a lot of injured players, but I am confident that they will do better in the new season and under a new coach. BTW, in case you're wondering - I'm a dedicated Sharks fan - and yes, my team lost the Currie Cup against the Lions last year, but what the heck - that's history. It would be tragic if the Lions had to make way for the Kings after having been part and parcel of the Rugby Unions for so many years... if need be, let them merge with the Cheetahs, but just keep them in the 'family!!!"

      Dakey - 2012-07-17 01:35

      Give the Lions a CHANCE??? Year Position SUPER 12 2002 11th 2003 12th 2004 12th 2005 11th Super 14 2006 13th 2007 12th 2008 14th 2009 12th 2010 14th Super 15 2011 14th 2012 15th They've been DEAD LAST 5 times in the LAST 10 YEARS. Forget for just a moment about the Watson's and think rationally about whether another team may just very well deserve it a bit more than the Lions.

      koos.vandermerwe.338 - 2012-07-17 02:35

      The Lions klapped the Queens in the warm up.

      SeanV1982 - 2012-07-17 08:45

      I say lets give the Lions a chance. Yes they have been last, or second last, for the last few years but their performance since Mitchell was removed has improved drematically. If we look at the wins and losses of the games without Mitchell at the helm, the points difference has been reduced. They even beat the Rebels, which is not an easy team to beat. So why don't we let the spectators, who are the people who watch the games (For those who don't know), decide the fate of the Lions?

      tom.tardis - 2012-07-17 09:05

      Dakeyras don't live in the past bud

      louis.bensch.31 - 2012-07-17 09:07

      @Dakeyras, you forgot to mention that Transvaal won the Super 10 in 1993, dont see alot of other South African teams with a Superugby title, now do ya?

      hvanderlinde - 2012-07-17 09:22

      Hey Dakeyras, The Kings can't even win the vodacom cup???? and you want them to jump the Curriecup and go straight into Super Rugby on the premis that the Lions haven't been performing and another team might DESERVE it more?? Really?

      Dakey - 2012-07-17 10:34

      @SeanV: "Yes they have been last, or second last, for the last few years " They've been last or second last the last 10 years... @Tom: "Dakeyras don't live in the past bud " I included 2012's performance. They cementing their 15th position all of 4 days ago. @Louis: "you forgot to mention that Transvaal won the Super 10 in 1993" Transvaal doesn't exists any more, nor the Super 10. The Stormers haven't won it either, but I'm sure we can all agree they're certainly more deserving. @HVande: "Hey Dakeyras, The Kings can't even win the vodacom cup" The Kings (as a franchise) does not receive R40,000,000 each year from SARU. Here's the thing, a franchise in the Eastern Cape would within 5 years be able to attract enough local youngsters to actually make it a GOOD team. Australia caught on to this when they created the Melbourn Rebels because they understood the potential for rugby to grow in Melbourn. The Lions have had ten years to do something about their problems and they have failed, time and time again. Even if they go 0-15 next year, the Kings will bring more fans to the stadiums than the embarrassment that is a sparsely populated Coke Cola park every time the Lions play.

      mark.pretorius1 - 2012-07-17 10:55

      @Dakeyras in that stint between 1998 and 2002 the Bulls were the bottom team three times and 2nd last twice. The Lions have been in 20 currie cup finals and have won 10, of which the last was in 2011(If you need a reminder). And for the EP they have never been in a currie cup final in the history of the competition. If you want to talk stats even the Griquas and Bulldogs have won at least 3 titles in their history. Why not give them a chance?

      marius.dejager.54 - 2012-07-17 11:01

      @Dakeyras....and the Kings? Are you saying they will/could do better. Open your eyes, the Kings won't achieve anything for the next 50 years in Super Rugby. Want to no why???. Because they want to use politic's and not rugby to gain a place.

      tom.tardis - 2012-07-17 14:15

      4 days ago is the past buddy

      Dakey - 2012-07-17 18:11

      @Tom:" 4 days ago is the past buddy " Okay, so your logic dictates that we should not base any decisions on events in the past? Don't really know how to counter that, you win! @Marius: 'Open your eyes, the Kings won't achieve anything for the next 50 years in Super Rugby. Want to no why???. Because they want to use politic's and not rugby to gain a place.' Yet the Lions without politics and loaded with cash... achieved what exactly in super rugby the last 10 years? Nothing, period. @Mark: "The Lions have been in 20 currie cup finals and have won 10, of which the last was in 2011(If you need a reminder). " Currie cup means nothing. It lost its value a long time ago when rugby teams started playing 2nd string players in this competition while resting their top players for Super Rugby. We're not discussing whether the Lions should be in the curry cup, we're discussing whether they should be in Super Rugby. I don't deny for a moment that losing the Lions will be GOOD, but if any team deserves to be dropped, it is them, hands down. If we had this discussion in 2002 and you told me that for the next 10 years the Lions would finish last, last, 2nd last, 2nd last, 3rd last, last, 4rd last, last.... would you say they deserved to continue playing Super Rugby? Goodness, at least fill 1/4 of a stadium and then try make a case for their inclusion. They don't even have any fans, most Gauteng folk support the bulls!

  • thabiso.s.bokwe - 2012-07-17 01:44

    SANZAR needs to revisit the current SupeRugby format. Perhaps have the Top3 franchises from each Conference play in a Premier Division of the competition and the others compete in a lower division.\r\n\r\nFor example: \r\n•Premier Division\r\nSA: Stormers, Bulls, Sharks\r\nNZ: Chiefs, Crusaders, Hurricanes\r\nAus: Reds, Brumbies, Waratahs\r\n\r\n•First Division\r\nSA: Cheetahs, Lions, Kings\r\nNZ: Highlanders, Blues, *\r\nAus: Rebels, Force, *\r\n*maybe an Argentinian franchise.\r\n\r\nRelegate/Promote teams at the end of the season.\r\n\r\nJudging by the amount of injuries the players sustain, one cannot help but feel that too much rugby is being played. Yes they get paid handsomely, but they aren't robots.

      ljmostert - 2012-07-17 07:18

      Good suggestion!

      nico.pretorius.946 - 2012-07-17 07:31

      I agree Thabiso, but why not first have the domestic competition, us the currie cup, nz their npc, and aus their own domestic competition, and the top 3 teams of each country play super 15 in the second part of the year.

      bootman.bokke - 2012-07-17 08:08

      Three teams from each country would gice you are they gonna play super 15?

      tom.tardis - 2012-07-17 14:16

      bootman u cant add boet. that equals 15

  • ruan.vanniekerk.754 - 2012-07-17 03:01

    So dissapointedwith the way we are treated. How are we supposed to get things going if they keep on changing their mind. I realy feel the kings deserve this chance. Sad to see who actually rules rugby in this country. Seems to be money and our selfish brothers up north. Sad sad sad

      nico.pretorius.946 - 2012-07-17 07:33

      ok Ruan, here is a tip, first WIN your second division, no excuses, provinces like boland and pumas and the likes could do it. then you will EARN your step up to the next level. When you are there, PERFORM and WIN something, then not all the kids in the playground will be nasty to you, and you don't have to be the teachers pet anymore :)

      ruan.vanniekerk.754 - 2012-07-17 08:02

      Valid point noted ;) here is the problem however, like I see it. We al know rugby is pro now. Ep wasn't to bad before that. Thing is, when it moved to pro, our administration 'invested' the money in other things. Now, we have more than a decade to make up. The current administration invests the money better, it seems. Teams like boland is the smaller union in that region, which means, I'm shure, they have the backing of wp should they need something. Ep however is the 'big' union in this region. So who wil back them. Obviously nog the other unions. So that means government has to. Give the money and help us catch up. If with the same resources as lions and they beat us then, (after say 2 years of building)for sure, take kings out. Just my opinion ;)

      nico.pretorius.946 - 2012-07-17 08:18

      what resources of the Lions? we had the same problems with our administrators after the Luyt era, we are still struggling to recover. But we take it on the chin and move forward. And even with all the off field problems that plagued the Lions the last number of years, we were still competitive in the domestic competitions. We also loose our talent on a regular base and have to build again, we also have smaller unions, Leopards and Pumas that we must look after. So the only difference is that EP wants handouts and favors to reach the top where the Lions work and struggle to reach the top.

      ruan.vanniekerk.754 - 2012-07-17 08:26

      I understand your point. This debate can go on forever. Lol. Let's agree to disagree and hope that 5 years down the line this whole saga wil be over with the best team in the comp.

      luke.sportify - 2012-07-17 09:16

      Well said Ruan, Nico do you have any idea how much money the Lions Franchise get for playing Super Rugby? EP/SWD/Border are not linked to any Super Rugby teams so no cash injection or top rugby to be able to keep top players.. EP Kings will win this years Currie Cup first division and then gain promotion on merit

      nico.pretorius.946 - 2012-07-17 09:29

      no problem Ruan :) my point is just, if the Kings deserved to be there, the whole country would back them, it's not that I don't want to see them there, they must just deserve to be there, longer road, but more satisfying in the end. The best thing for me that would come out of this if the kings are promoted is the promotion/relegation that would have been part of the agreement. I know the kings would have been spared that the first few years, but eventually we will see the best teams in the country playing super rugby, not teams based on historical or political stuff. That would also give all the other smaller unions something to work towards.

      marius.dejager.54 - 2012-07-17 11:07

      nico.pretorius, a whole case of Bell's for you!!

      tom.tardis - 2012-07-17 14:16

      and a running p0es klap

  • heinrich.vanjaarsveld.52 - 2012-07-17 03:37

    The kings can't win the vodacom cup can't win the promotion games to play currie cup what trophys does the kings even have the lions won a warm up match 88 to 0 in a pre season warm up game what's the crusaders chiefs waratahs and all the top teams gona do to them I don't wana see scores above 100 each team they play against top nations the lions can win games they did win the currie cup beat bove sharks bulls and stormers with their springboks and they did upset the lions this year the kings suck completly unless they get rid of watson he's the bad egg why they never win anything kings are a politics teams its the anc team so no they don't deserve it and will never deserve it

      matt.prinsloo.1 - 2012-07-17 06:49

      Kom ons sit net daai 88 0 in perspektief...\r\n81/

      bootman.bokke - 2012-07-17 08:10

      The Cheatahs beat the Stormers in a pre-season warmup what?

      heinrich.vanjaarsveld.52 - 2012-07-17 12:24

      Were not talking bout the cheetahs were talking bout the kings the cheetahs are competitors in the competition they beat a few great teams remember the saders last year most of there games this year they lost within 7 points show any of the 3 kings francises that play in the top provincial rugby there's no way they can compete with even the currie cup teams show me where's the so called great talent now cheetahs bring there school great players threw the rankings I don't see e.p bulldogs or swd beieng serous treads

  • sandile.vanheerden - 2012-07-17 04:28

    Goodbye KINGS!

  • Theo Ferreira - 2012-07-17 06:04

    To everyone saying The Kings can't even win the Vodacom Cup, be competitive in the Premier Currie Cup etc, please understand that they have not and could not yet bring the appropriate level and quantity of players on board as they are starting from scratch. In case you do not understand that concept, please start a rugby team and try to compete at Super 15 level in 2016. Good luck and let me know how it went. Give them a chance as clearly the Lions have squandered their chances, every single year since the competitions inception. Yes, they may do no better, but they sure as hell represent a union that has been bled dry of all talent off to greener pastures north of the Winterberge

      matt.prinsloo.1 - 2012-07-17 06:47

      Stem saam Theo. Almal verwag Kings moet presteer, maar Kings het nie dieselfde voordele as die ander nie.

      heinrich.vanjaarsveld.52 - 2012-07-17 06:52

      And yet the kings have players in their sqaud for 2 years now that represented super rugby franchises and still they get nothing right so tell me the lions lose star players every year and start every year from scratch the cheetash the same story the kings however got players in and still can't be competitive\r\nIn vodacom cup and first division currie cup if I'm wrong correct me but didn't the say in the beginning they will chose players that was born in that area and mostly will be black yet I see a lot of white players there the problem I see is that they good at telling stories but yet they can't stick to there words they have no guts no glory what so ever to speak of win the vodacom cup the first division cup first they can't play to teams that have no real names yet they can't beat them so how on earth do they think they can play with the big dogs

      luke.sportify - 2012-07-17 09:19

      @ Heinrich, how are the EP Kings doing in the Currie Cup first division? won 3 out of 3 games, 2 of them away(1 being Boland who won the title last year) It seems they are improving each year, with the SANZAR money and Sponsors cant you see them improving anymore, being able to put a decent squad together, also using the talent from SWD/Border

      heinrich.vanjaarsveld.52 - 2012-07-17 09:57

      And yet luke they were top last year and yet they still lost now how do u agree they deserve a change I don't see them playing currie cup nor does their partners now they don't deserve a spot get more cups first play currie cup beat them in the currie cup first how can you expect them to play super rugby if they can't even play decent currie cup

  • Theo Ferreira - 2012-07-17 06:07

    ...within one season they may just be more competitive than the Lions are right now. For the right money they will even be fielding some of the Lions' brighter stars. As for SARU, shame on you for making an absolute mockery if this process, your lack of leadership and planning is astounding in this particular matter, and the silence on your stance on this matter is deafening..

      Brian Heunis - 2012-07-17 06:56

      I thought the idea was to develop local EP based talent?

      ross.smilkstein - 2012-07-17 08:50

      You need to rely on other unions players is what you saying? I thought the whole point of the kings was to develop EP talent and to use above mentioned talent. Maybe the kings should first manage to win at the lowest levels of as rugby which is where they are now. This is sport not politics. You need to earn the right to play at a higher level by being better than the other teams, not by having a fake political figure as your union president. And what will puke do if the team aren't promoted? Vomit on a lions jersey?

  • werner.pretorius.12 - 2012-07-17 06:22

    Ek sal graag wil weet hoekom is een vd opsies Cheetas en Lions moet saamsmelt wat 400km uitmekaar is, maar nie met Bulls wat 50km verder is nie!!!

      danie.fick.98 - 2012-07-17 08:32

      Briljante punt Werner!!

      louis.bensch.31 - 2012-07-17 09:08

      Want die Leeus sal nooit so laag wil daal nie.....duh

  • matt.prinsloo.1 - 2012-07-17 06:27

    Belaglik. Dis nog n maand weg. Hoe moet Kings voorberei? En hoe moet Lions die volgende maand deurgaan? SARU is pateties. Ek hoop eerlik hierdie berig is verkeerd.

      louis.bensch.31 - 2012-07-17 09:43

      Wonder vir wat sou die queens moet voorberei......... seker om puke se kots van die rugbybal af te vee

      marius.dejager.54 - 2012-07-17 11:12

      louis.bensch, ek skink solank vir ons een, ref hulle in die Rooi LOL.

  • lionel.kemm.9 - 2012-07-17 06:40

    SARU messed up by promising the Kings a space in the Super rugby series in 2013 now they want the presidents of the various unions to vote,no backbone SARU to make your own decisions???

      sean.brady.14224 - 2012-07-17 09:46

      This is their way of washing their hands of the problem...

      lionel.kemm.9 - 2012-07-17 12:02

      Correct indeed

  • Michael Kleber - 2012-07-17 06:49

    SARU is a joke you cant develop the game in one area at the expense of another (JHB) EP were part of currie cup and fell out due to poor performances and were relegated so they had just as much opportunity then to play super rugby , in the future the top 5 positions in the currie cup play super rugby , currently all the super rugby positions were earned why cant the kings do the same , if they are pushed into super rugby what will their next demand be ? to be pushed into the semis ?

      Brian Heunis - 2012-07-17 06:55

      Can't agree more! Sad, because this "I/we want/demand" things without working for it mentality has ingrained itself in our society.

      ljmostert - 2012-07-17 07:00

      Nonsense! How was Super Rugby status 'earned'? WHERE MUST WE IN PE GO TO SEE SUPER RUGBY?

      scholtz.fourie.9 - 2012-07-17 07:32

      just remember that EP did participate in the original Super 10 way back. They then introduced ftanchise teams with Border,EP and Natal forming the Sharks. With the slow decline in Currie Cup quality,EP also started performing poorly in said competition. Eventually the Natal Sharks became the Sharks...devouring the small fish,Border and EP...\r\n\r\nEP played on merit before and lost there spot..they deserve a spot

      tom.tardis - 2012-07-17 09:07

      Ljmostert I'm sure u have some pubs and bars and golf clubs that will show the rugby, otherwise try your lounge

      luke.sportify - 2012-07-17 09:22

      Cant agree less, Rugby is a Pro Sport, No Super Rugby or no link to a Super Rugby Franchise means no money Without money you cant run a successful Franchise

  • ljmostert - 2012-07-17 07:12

    Super Rugby must be GEOGRAFHICALLY duistributed right through SA! Where must we in the Eastern Cape go to watch Super Rugby. Thousands of people in EC pay DSTV - a major sponsor of Super Rugby - so we are 'subsidising' the competition! Unfortunately rugby is also perceived as 'racist' and this is something that must be rectified. WE DEMAND SUPER RUGBy. Why must we now suddenly earn a Super Rugby spot whilst it was just dished out in the beginning when Super Rugby started!?

      michael.kleber.376 - 2012-07-17 07:27

      When super rugby started it was called super 10 the top currie cup teams went through EP were still playing currie cup and did not qualify , EP rugby went backwards until they were no longer even part of the currie cup , they must rebuild their team and finish within the top 5 of the currie cup and then be included in super rugby , the 1st super rugby trophy belonged to the lions who were then called transvaal

      gordon.pillay.73 - 2012-07-17 07:34

      Fully agreed, but let us wait and see how the vote goes. The other unions has been using that province as a feeding system,hopefully that will stop when the Kings goes up. However EP`s fate is in the hands of the very people that uses EP as a feeding system,so chances are small that Super rugby promotion will be gained.Time will tell....

      duane.vanvuuren - 2012-07-17 08:49

      Oh boy! There's that word again. "Demand!"...

  • jacques.duplessis.3785 - 2012-07-17 07:34

    I hope they take the last option!pls pls!!

  • wouter.dejager.3 - 2012-07-17 08:10

    Who is moderating these comments. How can continuous unrelated comments like "first", Ek sal jou mos half doodbliksem jou klein k*k etc. be tolerated... About the article, if it is true.. it is a very difficult decision. Option 2 probably makes most sense, but I wouldn't be surprised if they go with option 4, but this will have huge political implications... except if the R40 million comes into play then... They can go for the promotionrelegation scheme in 2014

      jonathan.golding.96 - 2012-07-17 11:51

      You are so right Wouter! Surely a blog should be available for considered views and counter-views. Attacking the man is both childish and totally unwarranted.

  • SeanV1982 - 2012-07-17 08:43

    I say this is noncense. The EP Kings should not be allowed in the super series as they are not of the callibre for this tornament. They proved earlier this year, with a defeat by the lions, that they are not worthy. above that, how can we have a team that can't even make it into the premier devision of the Currie Cup take on teams that have been playing super rugby for years? I say why not let the supports and spectators speak instead of the rugby bosses. We all know that the only reason that the EP kings are being concidered is because the owner is Cheeky Watson, Father of Luke Watson who couldn't even cut it as a springbok honestly. The fact that the EP Kings are being accused of accepting a R40M bribe is just proof of the corruption within South African Rugby. I don't know if anyone has noticed but the lions game changed after Mitchell was removed. Why did this not happen 2 years ago when the lions were really playing bad. Give the lions 1 more year in super rugby and you will see that we will be in the top numbers. If we want to remove the lions, then why not put in a more respected team like the Griquas. I bet they will have a better chance in the super rugby than the kings as they stay in the premier devision of the Currie cup every year and have not been relegated. So I want to ask, who should decide the fate of the Lions and the Kings? I say the people who watch the games should as we know what each team can do. So, should we allow SARU to handle this?

  • petrus.coetzee.50 - 2012-07-17 08:55

    Sick and tired of these Kings' supporters going on about home grown talent. We are living in a professional era! Wake up!

      luke.sportify - 2012-07-17 09:30

      @ Pertus, how is the EC supposed to keep its talent without Super Rugby?? SWD/EP/Border are not linked to any of the Franchises... You wake you IDIOT

      john.a.swart - 2012-07-17 11:01

      I agree Petrus. The fact is that the EPRU need to accept responsibility for the many years of mismanagement and corruption that led to the demise of rugby in the region. History reveals that EP were a force to be reckoned with in SA Rugby over many decades but the introduction of inept, corrupt and incompetent administrators in the latter half of the 90's were the cause of their demise. Cheeky Watson, and I'm not a fan of him at all, has made changes to rectify the situation but that does not mean there is a right of entitlement to play Superugby. EP have to EARN their right by virtue of first deserving their right to play Premier Division Currie Cup and, secondly, by winning in a promotion/relegation playoff for Superugby status. Living in PE, I would love to see Superugby at our new stadium but I want to see a Super Kings team that has earned the right to be there irrespective of whether they win or lose. Introspection, honest analysis and accepting responsibility for past decicions will translate into improved infrastructure and administration that will map the way forward for the Super Kings to gain the credibility they need to be part of Superugby. This is the professional era - there are no short cuts! Entitlement will more than likely result in a retreaded Lions squad playing for the Super Kings and will do nothing to retain the services of the future Ndungwane twins, Kankowski"s, Daniels etc. etc. Do it the hard way, the proper way and reap the benefits!

      matt.prinsloo.1 - 2012-07-17 21:19

      If you expect them to earn their place, level the playing field, ie give them the same benefits as the rest. Again, 11 provincial unions benefit from SR, 3 don't. How is that fair? The other franchises rob the Kings unions of all their talent, of all races. But in order to keep the powers in charge happy, especially players of color. Yes, it is a professional era. Like it or not, players of color must make part of every franchise's products. If they were developing their own instead of poaching from the 3 Kings unions, well... JOHAN, even if we win the 1st division and gain promotion to CC, but we have no SR benefits, we won't be able to keep our best players, we won't be able to contract top quality players and thus we won't be able to take that one last step...

  • AlQuestioningLife - 2012-07-17 09:27

    Why can't the Bulls & Lions merge as they are both in Gauteng. Pretoria is only 40mins travel from Joburg so it is easy to get to practices. Makes no sense in wanting to split up a Free [Cheetah] Team by adding Gauteng players amonst them. Then comes the next ? What makes a second division team think they have automatic rights to the super 15 away. The should have a play off with the Lions and the winner then plays in the super 15.

  • luke.sportify - 2012-07-17 09:42

    Cant they call an emergency meeting and vote on this next week??

  • sean.brady.14224 - 2012-07-17 09:45

    The Kings will get in on this vote. SARU are on record as saying that the SA side who comes last in 2013 will play the Lions in promotion/relegation match. There is a further exemption that the Kings are excluded until 2015! The next last team will therefore play the Lions. The Lions will get 4 votes at the meeting, the minnow Unions will vote for the Kings!

      sean.brady.14224 - 2012-07-17 09:49

      The Lions will get 5 votes as they should vote for themselves ;).

      nico.pretorius.946 - 2012-07-17 10:39

      Lions will get: themselves, pumas & leopards = 3 also Bulls & Falcons = 2 also WP & Boland = 2 also Freestate, Griquas & Northern Freestate = 3 also Natal & Border = 2 total of 12 votes :) minows will go with their bigger holding unions, that is where their money comes from.

      heinrich.vanjaarsveld.52 - 2012-07-17 10:41

      Sharks leeus cheetahs griekwas bulle w.p boland pumas valke luiperds griffons hul almal gaan vir leeus stem ds maks stemme maar hul gaan nie minder as 7 kry nie so kings val uit ni een van die super spanne gaan vir hul stem ni en cheetahs gee 3 stemme plus die ander 4 spanne leeus kry baie steuning van luiperds so kanse vir kings is byna niks

  • - 2012-07-17 10:00

    treat the competition as a champions league qualification. the top5 teams in the currie cup play super rugby. no matter who they are. they should rather have a play off between the two teams. home and away. winner plays SR. entry into the competition should be earned, not just given.

  • marius.olivier.7 - 2012-07-17 10:07

    This is like 5 foxes and a chicken having to decide what's for dinner

  • - 2012-07-17 10:14

    they should treat the competition like they do the Heineken cup. the top teams in the division play in the competition. then this will not be a problem. also entry into the competition should be earned not just given. they should also consider a play off. home and away, winner plays SR. use it, dont use it.

  • paul.sdoow - 2012-07-17 10:52

    why not use that 40mil and buy some votes cheeky?

  • edwardsch - 2012-07-17 11:29

    Get the Kings to play a best of three matches against the Lions. One at home for each and if a decider is required, that one to be played at a neutral ground. If the Kings are good enough, then they get into the Super 15. If not, sorry Cheeky, But you will have to try another way of wriggling your way into the competition !!!!!

  • gerrit.volschenk - 2012-07-17 11:31

    @Dakeyras apart from the tests when was your stadium filled.That is part of the lies being spread by EP.The first being that the reason for inclusion is to promote rugby to the previously disadvantaged players.Added to that off course is the pathetic assumption that the Eastern Cape is the home of rugby. No rugby player from any province will switch their jersey for one from the Kings who came up with that proposal. Let the Kings play so we can have some humor in the competition and the world can see they do not belong at that level.

      Dakey - 2012-07-18 01:10

      Gerrit, we have schoolboys over here offered scholarships to play rugby at other schools. EP Rugby was messed up, no-one is denying that, however the state of South African rugby does not allow a team to improve. Even players local to the Eastern Cape do not wish to play for the Kings because: 1. Money is poor. 2. No exposure to higher division rugby. 3. No chance to make the Springbok team Even the most passionate player has but no choice to leave Eastern Province and play elsewhere. That has been the case for at least 18 years and SARU has done nothing about the matter. Truth is they should have taken control of EP many years ago and got rid of those that ran it into the ground.

  • jonathan.golding.96 - 2012-07-17 11:42

    With the best will in the world, the Kings cannot get their team up to S15 standard in 6 months. The Lions management and public cannot be deprived because of a (maybe well-intented) rash decision. Let matters tand as they are and review the matter sensibly during the off season with a view to finding a sloution for 2014 or 2015

  • francisco.j.pedro - 2012-07-17 12:37

    the argument can be made that the kings struggle because their promising stars are pilfered by the super rugbyplaying unions. but then again the lions union has the same problem and so do the cheetahs. the s also logic in saying that should the ep kings have a super rugby berth their promising stars might be more inclined to stay. although i think there are better structures in the top three super rugby unions than in the bottom three and that is why rugby players opt to play in those unions. i think the unions who heamorage players need to consider working on better structures. although that haing been said the cheetahs have some of the best rugby development structures but still can't keep a large majority of their players take this season alone. WP Nel, Ashley johnson and Sias Eberson... so it's a question of giving a union what they want or giving SA rugby what it needs.

  • llewellyn.williams - 2012-07-17 12:57

    It does not make any sense to have a 2nd division side in super 15 but if an agreement was made then it has to be honoured so the best bet is to help the Kings with coaching and a few players to bring them up to std hopefully ie give them a trial period (season/s)

  • dewald.pretorius.37 - 2012-07-17 13:17

    Ep Kings,u guys suck!!Can't even beat the Pumas!! U know I want a 100 million bucks but will I get it? NO I won't!!! So I guess I will just have 2 work hard and maybe one day I will have that amount. So please no free bee's. SA owes u nothing. No one owes u anything. Ur rugby sucks. U guys look like our soccer players on the field. U want to do nothing and get rewarded for that eish!! Bet u the under 19 springbok craven week team will beat ur sorry asses. U guys are making the whole of SA hate u cause u can't play RUGBY but u want everything boss

      luke.sportify - 2012-07-17 17:33

      someone steal your brandy?

  • tim.kilpin - 2012-07-17 14:08

    The Lions / Cheetahs merge will not work a second time around. As bad as the old Coastal Sharks which was a f .. up right from the start

  • matt.prinsloo.1 - 2012-07-17 15:29

    \\Courtesy of EP Kings Army FB page\\: If you get a list of the Super Rugby players that started the most number of games in their position for their teams this season (i.e. 15 x 5 = 75 players) and you look at where they were born (and what team they would've represented if they stayed put for their entire career, you get:\\r\\nStormers (18 players)\\r\\nKings (17 players)\\r\\nLions (14.5 players*)\\r\\nCheetahs (10.5 players*)\\r\\n... Bulls (8 players)\\r\\nSharks (6 players)\\r\\nNamibia (1 player)\\r\\n\\r\\n* According to, Coenie Oosthuizen was born in Potchefstroom/Kimberley, hence the half.\\r\\n\\r\\nThe 17 Kings players are - JC Janse van Rensburg, Steven Sykes, CJ Stander, Siya Kolisi, Jacques Potgieter, Philip van der Walt, Keegan Daniel, Johan Goosen, Elton Jantjies, Bjorn Bassson, Michael Killian, Lwazi Mvovo, Tim Whitehead, JJ Engelbrecht, Akona Ndungane, Cameron Jacobs and Zane Kirchner.\\r\\n\\r\\nNow, I know some might just have been born in the area and left at an early age, etc, etc. (and the above might contain the odd error), but I still think it does prove that there definitely it's a lot of talent coming out of the area. If the Kings can catch them and develop them properly, the future will be bright...

      heinrich.vanjaarsveld.52 - 2012-07-17 17:08

      And there I say they should take the 40mil and start develop them at a early stage cause if u push them into super rugby now they won't be able to keep up the pace and will be burned out

      matt.prinsloo.1 - 2012-07-17 17:40

      No, sorry. They will be developing players simply for the Super Rugby franchises to poach them again. I suggest they get a chance at SR. Right now they won't be able to field a team with mostly EP (EC) products as most of their best products are playing elsewhere and the ones coming through now need experienced guys to guide them. I say buy some players to get the ball rolling and that way establish a team. Then as youngsters are developed they can be offered contracts to play for that team. EP already offered 8 academy players contracts, and once a team is established those guys and others to come can get into the system. Also: the Kings efforts to bring them home and keep them home won't work with 100 percent of the players, but they have managed to lure back some already...

      nico.pretorius.946 - 2012-07-17 18:02

      Here is a question for you matt, if a guy is born in Natal, goes to a private school in Johannesburg, study for docter in Pretoria, become a heart surgeon in Cape Town, runs a heart clinic in New York, and finally moves to London where he makes a big breakthrough in heart surgery, who claims him? Every player is developed at every union he plays for, there is very few Schalk Burgers around, so your argument does not hold water. Those players you claim might have been born in EP, but they were developed and improved to the level they are now at other unions.

      matt.prinsloo.1 - 2012-07-17 18:16

      Read my comment thoroughly. I understand players move. But if Kings get SR they could well be the one developing those players to the levels they reach in the end. Part of the rrason why EP established the Academy. Look at EP's age group results and you will see there is enough of that talent actually starting their rugby here.

      Dakey - 2012-07-17 21:37

      Precisely. Hennie LeRoux, Garth Wright, Andre Vos... A lot of quality players come from the Eastern Cape, heck Despatch use to be the #1 club in the country for many years. Problem is other provinces poach players.

      heinrich.vanjaarsveld.52 - 2012-07-18 04:09

      So if I was born in EP and moved out of there say at age 3 before I became some great talent in rugby I got my roots from EP don't think so many of the players haven't played 1 game in EP so they wernt poach at all they started playing rugby in other provinces where they started the careers u may be born there but if u never played a game there u aren't a talent from that part cause nobody taught u anything catch a wake up call u not putting up a good argument

      matt.prinsloo.1 - 2012-07-18 08:28

      Heinrich, die \catch a wake up\ phrase van jou is afgesaag. Jys obviously nie baie bright nie. Ek wonder selfs of jy ordentlik kan lees want ek het reeds van jou punte erken en bevestig in my oorspronklike post, maw die dat hulle dalk net hier gebore is. Maar aangesien jy jouself so briljant ag, verduidelik asb vir ons hoe die OP (en soms die ander Kings unies) nog reg kry om uiters mededingend te wees op u13, u16 Cravenweek en ander ouderdoms vlakke? Verduidelik ook sommer hoekom so min van die ander unies die moeite gedoen het om nie blanke spelers te ontwikkel ipv hulle te poach uit die Kings area. Hulle het almal geweet transformasie (of ons nou daarvan hou of nie) is deel van enige sport in SA. As hulle self spelers uit hul eie unies ontwikkel het, dan sou die politici nie n probleem met hulle gehad het nie. Plus, dan sou Kings self van hul eie produkte kon aanwend. Rugby is profesioneel, maw elke unie word bestuur soos n besigheid. En een van daai besigheid se produkte moet spelers van kleur wees. En terloops, as die Lions so briljante unie is, dan sal hulle sekelik n jaar of 3 sonder SR kan oorleef. Daai bank balans is seker stewig as mens dink aan al die jare wat hulle SR voordele gehad het. En die Lions supporters sal seker nog steeds gaan kyk al is die span net in Vodacom Cup of wat ookal. Laastens: ons Kings supporters is supporters nes julle almal anders. Ons skree vir die Bokke en die ander SA spanne in SR as hulle teen OZ of NZ spanne speel, ons is ook moerig nes julle vir Luke oor sy kotz comment. Maar ons wil net he ons 3unies moet dieselfde voordele he as die ander 11.

  • bruceqg - 2012-07-17 16:41

    This story is getting a lot of attention all for the sake of money.

  • luke.sportify - 2012-07-17 17:38

    Where are all the people from who are so against the Southern Kings playing Super Rugby? Is it mainly angry Lions Supporters? I am a neutral, I support the Sharks but am all for the EC being represented I dont want the Lions to be kicked out and I am sure SARU wont allow this to happen

  • philschalkwyk - 2012-07-18 18:25

    Puke Watson should stop pushing for their inclusion in Super Rugby as he is going to be extremely embarrased if it happens. They will loose every game by big scores!

  • charles.morton.581 - 2012-08-12 16:55

    This EP Kings/Lions mess is surely covered somewhere in either the Constitution of SARU or the Rules of SANZAR. It is hard to believe that a side's ability to continue to compete in this competition without challenge could be allowed? What if the Rebels franchise is beaten so badly every year that their sponsors withdraw, would they be allowed to continue and get beaten by 100 points every game ad nauseum? That sounds far fetched. It also seems far fetched to kick a team out of the competition on a political whim rather than through normally accepted play-off conditions. Something is seriously abnormal here and should have been written in to the T&Cs governing the right of competing in the competition.

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